Trouble on the Hunt Ranch!
My son and his friends are always doing something stupid and getting themselves in to trouble. Why, why, why? I understand that (at his age) it is normal to do things like the things that I'm about to mention. I occasionally did smiler things myself, but after getting in trouble I learned from my mistakes and moved on. My son, however, doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes and he is building a history of repeating the same mistakes over and over again. I'm debating as to weather I need to come up with a new form of punishment. It appears that what I'm doing just doesn't work with him. I may need some help on this one.
A short while back, I took a walk around the property and found that my kids had took the pruning sheers and made an attempt at pruning some trees, about 20 of them. They must have worked for a couple hours at it judging by the amount of brush that they left all over the ground. My poor trees did nothing to deserve this. It wasn't the attempt at pruning the trees that made me so angry, it was the hitting them with hammers and scaring them up for no reason that angered me. Oh, and cutting a 4 foot hole in the hedges so that they can walk through them... ERRRR!!!! I made the kids take all that brush and walk it around to the burn pile a couple acres away, all of it! There was two weeks of groundation to follow, with no video games, no computer, and no company.
Here's the problem, I felt bad for (my son) after a week, so I decided to let him work off his other week by hauling wood and stacking it. That's my fault!
A week or so after that incident, I had discovered that my wife had let my son buy a BB gun from wal-mart. I informed her that I feel that he is not mature enough for a BB Gun yet, and that I don't think he should have one, "he'll put somebody's eye out" I said. My wife gave me the "he's 12 years old", give him some credit, "he isn't a baby anymore" lecture.
I cringed my teeth and said you'll see, I have a bad feeling about this one.
Two days later I had discovered that he had shot the window out of one of our out buildings. I was so ticked off that I couldn't talk. I was so mad that, in fact, that I didn't talk. I decided to wait a day or so before telling anybody that I had noticed the window so that I would have time to cool off and handle the situation in a non aggressive way. I called him outside and told him the story about how I wanted to confiscate the gun, but mom said that I shouldn't do it. I told him that I'm not mad about the window because I knew that it was doing to happen and so by letting it happen, I feel just as responsible for it happening as he is for doing it. He said it was an accident and promised to be more careful and I believed him.
Two days ago I found a hammer on the ground outside. I hate it when the kids use my tools and leave them all over the property. I find tools clear out in the field when I'm on the tractor. Why would a kid need a damn pair of vice grips out in an open field? Anyway, I look at the closest tree next to the hammer and my son had hammered a bunch of nails in to it for no reason, not to make a tree fort, or anything like that, but just for the hell of it. I brought him outside and told him how disappointed I was that he didn't learn his lesson about defacing the property out here. I explained to him that I work full time in order for us to afford to live here and he is being totally disrespectful to me by doing things like this. "Sorry dad"
Well, last night I has a visit from my neighbor. Guess what! My son and his friend went over to my closest neighbors property and shot the windows out of his cars. Not one, but two of them. Two cars that is, several windows. I guess the groundation thing isn't working out very well, I don't think my son is learning his lesson. I'm so angry right now you would not believe.
For the record, my closest neighbor is many acres away, he doesn't actually live there, he has a shop there on his property where he repairs race cars and tinkers. The two cars were not his every day cars, they were two cars that have been sitting for a year or so, but they were nun the less his cars on his property and they has no broken windows a few days ago. Oh, and one was a truck, now you have the facts.
I'm holding off with punishment long enough to get some advice and opinions from others... What do you all think? The redneck side of me wants to spank some ass right now, but the softer side just think that I need to find a creative and intelligent way of dealing with this parenting problem that I'm facing.
I'm open to suggestions!
posted by John & Jennifer @ 5:21 PM
14 comments
14 Comments:
John,
I’m not a parent and have little desire to be one, but I hate to see someone lose the potential that is their child, because I‘m supposed to be a teacher -- and so are you!
“I took a walk around the property and found that my kids had took the pruning sheers and made an attempt at pruning some trees, about 20 of them. They must have worked for a couple hours at it judging by the amount of brush that they left all over the ground. My poor trees did nothing to deserve this. It wasn't the attempt at pruning the trees that made me so angry, it was the hitting them with hammers and scaring them up for no reason that angered me. Oh, and cutting a 4 foot hole in the hedges so that they can walk through them... ERRRR!!!!”
I’m sorry but this is just so funny! Kids hacked away at some trees and shrubs and no one knew. What would you think of your schools if teachers let their children run around on the playground for two hours without checking on them? You’d be pissed!
Part of the reason I’m not a teacher is because some parents don’t want to or forget to be parents. To a parent a twelve year old boy is still their little boy, but the truth is he’s on the cusp of manhood, and beginning to develop the energy of a man. That energy has to be channeled, and if his parents won’t channel that energy, eventually, society will.
They cut a hole in your hedge, because they wanted a gateway to shorten their route. Fine. So build a gate. What does a gate cost? A hundred bucks. You hang out with Donny, I can probably guess that you won’t miss a hundred bucks. Meanwhile, as father and son are building the gate, talk to the kid. Find out what he likes. What he doesn’t like. Does he smoke? Does he drink? Does he like girls? Does he do drugs? Does he like sports? Does he not like living in the country? How was school? Does he like math? History? Science? There are hundreds of questions that need answering, but when you get the basics you can help him find his own answers with books, projects, and support.
Also, be his conscience. Every f&#^#^g day.
Where you going? Who you seeing? How long you going to be gone? After a few weeks of this he’ll answer those questions before you even ask. And, Who knows, maybe every time he walks through that gate he’ll remember that conversation, so plan it carefully -- as carefully as you would a business presentation, and with a little luck you’ll hardwire a conscience into the young man.
Randy
John,
A spanking is definitely in order and long overdue. The caution is that the spanking must be recognized by your son as punishment and not abuse. Assure him that it is the just and necessary response to his bad acts and that you get no pleasure from the punishment.
A monetary penalty at his age would be an additional tool that should work well.
If there is no fear of punishment, there is little (or no) consideration given prior to committing bad acts.
- David
At twelve, spankings no longer work. As another poster suggested he is on the cusp of manhood. Recognize this and relay to your son that you recognize this. Put the responsibility on him. Also hold him responsible for his actions. He needs to meet face to face with the neighbor and appologize man to man. He also needs to find a way to repay the neighbor for the damage done. Whether he works for you to earn cash to give the neighbor, or works directly for the neighbor pruning trees (ha ha)etc... It is time to build character in your son. Work ethic and consequences for his actions. I would have told him about the responsibilities that come with gun ownership and that if he can not be responsible he will not own a gun. Then once a window was broken, the gun was gone. A little late for that. But you can do it now and the next time (hopefully there won't be a next time) then you can take the gun away and again make him responsible for his actions.
Also, put him in a Hunter's Safety course so he learns how to properly handle a weapon. I am sure you have taught him some, but somewhere he missed the message and if he insists on acting like a 6 year old then inform him you will treat him like one. Let him know the responsibility lies within him and he makes his choices. Even when he is showing off to friends......
FYI - I am sure this lesson will be shortly dealt with at my house as my husbands oldest son just bought Hunter a BB/pellet gun for Christmas. So far he has been responsible with it, but I am sure he will test his limits soon!
Good luck. Keep us posted on the outcome.
Chantel said...
"At twelve, spankings no longer work."
You are speaking neither from experience nor from training.
I would caution you against advising others solely based upon your personal opinions. This is very dangerous, at worst, and unproductive, at best.
- David
Shoot him in the leg with a BB Gun and shave part of his head.
Anonymous,
That is a good suggestion. I would suggest a BB shot to each butt cheek, rather than the leg, however. Each time he sits, he will be reminded of his bad behavior.
- David
David,
I'd have to challenge the statement "You are speaking neither from experience nor from training" by inquiring about your own experience and/or training. I am not attempting to be mean in any way, but I know you and therefore am aware of your lack of either. Sorry, but it's true.
Chantel, in my opinion, offered some great advice.
Randy, John's children are 10 years old and 12 years old. They are therefore old enough to roam a fenced, gated 11 acre parcel without constant parental supervision. I roamed my grandparents' property at a much younger age.
It's my opinion that Brian should be punished in such a way that he remember it for quite some time. That would include grounding him from his video game systems, as I've been told has happened. It would also include speaking man to man with the neighbor as recommended by others. That has also happened to the best of my knowledge.
Personally, I'd also make him figure out some sort of service to repay the neighbor the amount of damages done to the property.
Finally, I'd have a long talk with him myself and tell him how he is now a young man and must uphold the family name, that his actions shame it, that his father is very disappointed in him, and that better behavior is expected in the future. I remember my dad having similar conversations with me and those conversations would bring me to tears and have a much larger impact than any physical form of discipline such as spanking. Spanking is too easy. It is for the simple minded, in my opinion. It only teaches children to react to conflict with violence. We're all more intelligent than that.
- Donny -
I think you have some sound advice here already. By your own admission, you have never spanked your children. Which, on a lot of levels these days is a good thing.
I think that at 10 and 12 years of age, your children are already too old for this method to be effective. More likely a spanking now would only serve to create more behaviour problems. Anger, rage and resentment would almost surely result. I know you don't want to instill these things in your children.
Besides a gun safety class, you may want to write up a "contract" containing proper usage and behaviours with the BB gun. Allow a little "negotiating" room so that your son has a little space to put in his 2 cents. Make sure that you have different degres of punishment for different infractions. Say for instance. he shoots out a light bulb-he loses possession of the BB gun for 1 day and escalate as necessary depending on importance. Of course the max should be losing possession alltogether with no redemption. Make it as real to life as possible, including fines, restitution, etc. Then sit him down and discuss the rules with him.
Make 2 copies, 1 for him and one for you. After you have discussed it thoroughly with him, have him sign both copies like a real contract. Then have him post his in a place conspicuous to him.
Start making him own his mistakes and bad behaviours. You're not doing yourself or your children any good by taking partial blame for their misdoings!
It's not going to be too much longer before he's going to want to drive. If he can't be trusted with a BB gun...well you get the picture.
Donny,
Actually, I was speaking from experience (both as a post-12-year-old boy who received efficacious spanking and as a step-father who applied efficacious spanking) and training.
While in an ideal world there would be no need for physical punishment, this is, unfortunately, not an ideal world.
Interestingly, when I was in school, spanking was commonly applied to youth who misbehaved. This punishment was very effective. It required parental consent, of course. The spanking was applied by the principal, using a ping pong paddle. This form of punishment was active throughout grammar school and high school.
As a student at CSUC, I became very interested in the psychology of punishment and studied and researched this issue a good deal. Experts in the field are nearly unanimous in the espousal of physical punishment as a judicious and effective means of bringing children to an understanding of the concept of physical punishment for bad acts.
Traditionally, children who are allowed to misbehave without benefit of physical punishment and considerably more likely to lack self-restraint in later years. Studies done by research psychologists on young criminals clearly indicate that the vast majority of these lawbreakers fall into one of two groups—those who were never physically punished and those who were physically punished inappropriately and severely.
The caution with physical punishment is it must be applied without anger or malice and must be applied instead with love and concern for the psychological welfare of the child.
One need only give brief overview to the degenerate level to which the youth of our nation has fallen to see proof that the undue freedom allowed youth in our society results in a society of youth with a skewed concept of propriety who operate nearly solely on the principle of gratification without fear of punishment.
- David
Your son is at an age when things can get a lot worse quickly.
FIRST, you and your wife need to get on the same page and develop a plan of setting boundrys and limits. Then implement that plan consistantly.
Since he's been developing questionable judgement lately, this is kinda like an intervention. It's time for a united front and a serious explanation of your plan to him.
Take the boy over to your neighbors and make his apologies. Pay for the damage and put the boy to work around the house doing chores to pay you back. All guns/ slingshots/ tools of destruction are 86'ed. If he balks, complains or messes up he needs to see a united front from you and your wife.
As he does good loosen the rope. As he does bad bring it back in.
The parents of his "partner in crime" need to be on the same page also.
Boy Scout Troop 62 in Corning, where I'm a commitee member, is currently recruiting. We meet every Wed. at 7pm at the Knights of Columbus hall at the Catholic Church. The Troop is completely non-denominational.
I appreciate all of your advice. I have taken most of it to heart. I shot him in the butt twice with a pellet gun, and I'm making him work off his Dr. Bill by mowing the neighbors 100 acres with a mechanical push mower.
On a serious not, I really don't like blogging about negative things, but I actually did go through a moment of fear that I was losing control of him and that is a scary thing.
Here is what I did,
He was grounded to his room for over a week, only coming out to go to the bathroom, there was no TV, no video games, no company, and no forms of entertainment.
After that week, he is aloud to come out of his room, but still no computer, video games, or anything like that for 3 more weeks.
When the weather improves, he will also be working for the neighbor doing some kind of yard work.
That may not seem to be enough punishment for some of you, but believe me, for him, that is eternity.
-John
John,
I have 3 little girls, and my oldest is 5. I've never dealt with a 12 y/o boy, but my 5 y/o is defiant and likes to do things over and over again. You've probably already taken care of this situation, and I defiantely think you have a soft side, but in cases like this, I think you need to be harsh. The boy obviously isn't learning his lesson, and by you letting him off the hook after a week, just lets him know that 'hey I can walk all over dad and get away with it. This might sound bad to you, but I think if you have a bad feeling about something your wife bought your son, make sure you don't let him play with the thing w/out your supervision. You've got a lot of land, he is bound to wander out of your sight and do something stupid. Make sure you know where he is. He sounds like he cant be left alone, and I think that at this point he has proven it, and he should lose his priviledges to be let loose on the property. If that is what it takes to get him to be respectful.
Well that is my oppinion, take it for what you think it is worth.
Sherry
Hey Sherry,
Glad to hear from you. I usually post in this blog a lot more often, however, I've been very busy for the past several weeks.
I hope that you check back form time to time. I promise you that I will find something more interesting then my parental problems for my next entry. Which I'm hoping will be soon. As I've said, life has been keeping me busy lately.
Well John, looks like you got a grip on this situation. At least to your own satisfaction any way (that's what matters).
I am bored, so thought I'd drop in to see what's happening, wave four fingers and a thumb and move on along.
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